Beginner equipment advice

[Ozz]

Hi. I took up windsurfing about 2 months ago thinking that Nicola lake was a prime windsurfing location but so far have only managed to meet 3 others on the lake so I am suffering from lack of advice (2 were novices and the 3rd was anxious to get sailing so I diddnt ask too many questions) So I wonder if I could get a little advice I am 210 lbs *coughfiftysomethingcough* years old and I got a bic core techno 205l board with a 5.5 and 7 m2 sails My problem is that I cant seem to sustain a plane I think it is because there is never enough wind altho I seem to feel fear when I look at it. I estimate that it is maxing out at 12 - 15 mph waves are a couple feet high and a few whitecaps. When I do get planing I cant seem to get back far enough for the straps without sinking the tail. I am wondering if I should be looking at a smaller board, or if I should get a bigger sail and if I do will it be useable when I do upgrade the board (thinking about 140l next year I cant waterstart yet either hoping I can uphaul it) I have a 460 mast and if I get a much bigger sail I need a new mast boom etc and I am not sure if I will use them on a smaller board. So can I blame the wind and jsut wait for better days? or will a big rig get me up? Most of the time I can pump onto a plane but cannot stay there. Any help would be appreciated and if this is not the right place could someone tell me where to look? I have hunted the net but they all seem to assume that there is lots of wind.
Hmm if i could channel my long windedness I would have no problems.

[KUS]

210 myself on a good day. 205L is friggen huge, no way sinking the tail is the problem....that size of board is probably tough to get planing, never mind keeping it there. To plane or not or keeping it there has lots to do with ability although it is tough to admit at times. The sail sizes sound pretty good to me.

Having said this: Nicola is gusty and that might be the issue, very difficult to learn in gusty winds. You would round up when the gust dies on any board if you don't step up and/or learn to anticipate by reading the water and bear off downwind hoping to plane through til the next gust arrives.

At your weight you should be easily able to uphaul a 140L, I would go for a 125 or 130 if you know how to plane already, maybe even a 110. If you can pump a board onto a plane you already have some very good skills. The smaller the easier it will be to learn to waterstart as sinking the tail on the waterstart makes things easier stepping upward and a 110 is still pretty floaty and you will be able to use this investment for a longer time.

Learning in lame wind is pretty tough, Nicola is exceptionally gusty, maybe Stump Lake is a better bet too, seems steadier to me. Plan on a full week of Nitinat in summer, you will increase your skill levels dramatically

[Ozz]

Thanks for the quick reply The board is suposed to be early planing they say but it is huge. The lake is gusty for sure I head to the okanagan lake when the weather thing says there is wind there but it is always dying when I get there it seems. I work 4 x 4 shifts so a trip to Nitinat is in the plans Also thinking about a windsurf holiday maybe to venezuela this winter for some lessons. So my best bet is to stick with the sails and get a smaller board? Or will I have to get the whole works?

[more force 4]

Ozz, you don't have others to compare experience with, are you sure you are actually planing? The way you describe it, it sounds like you may be 'semi-planing', just before the point the board transitions to a proper fast plane. I say this because beginers often post on various forums thinking they are planing, more experienced sailors question them, then they often come back a few days later saying "wow, NOW I've planed, felt like I'd never gone so fast in my life before", etc. 12 or 15 knots of wind with a 'few' whitecaps doesn't sound like enough power to plane a big guy on a heavy board with a 7.0 unless they are very skilled (and had you switched to the smaller sail?) . I used to sail dinghys on both Nicola and Stump and I know it can get proper windy - were there long streaks of foam down the lake on the days you were out?

Are you in a harness yet? Sounds like you aren't in the straps. Don't try and get into them if the tail sinks - it means you aren't going fast enough yet. Try sinking your weight down and hanging UNDER the booms as you are on a slightly broad reach (just below a right angle to the true wind), you back hand well back, next time. If the board really picks up speed, then work your feet slowly back.

210 is big, but size can help in marginal wind. Once you sail stronger winds and learn to plane, then the extra size gets in the way. Then you'll be ready for a 130-140 litre board, and shortly after a sub 100 litre for the 20 knot + days. I'd hold off on switching boards till after that Venezuelan holiday - you will improve so fast (especially with lessons) that you'll have a much better idea of what suits you and your conditions after that. Your sails sound good for now to me too.

Better to ask for advice when the more experienced sailor is coming in for a break or finishing a session, unless they are doddling about and waiting for the wind to get better. You'll recognize the crazed look and frenzied rigging of the addict about to get a fix!
Don't worry about posting beginner questions on the forum, thats what they are there for and this is a great place to get to know some people you are bound to meet in person later!

[Ozz]

Thanks Morewind. I think you may be right I took the board to Kamloops lake today because the weather network said 16mph winds and I was able to finally get it planing. It was very gusty and I was sheeting in and out trying to stay upright but finally got onto a full plane (your right there is a difference) WOW! I found I was able to get into the back strap just before it really took off. Once on a plane I kinda headed downwind (not my plan but lets just say I was less than 100 percent in control)and was wondering what to do next. I diddnt get the front foot into the strap but was standing on it. Bouncing over the waves I was too off balance. After my impact with the mast I noticed that my clew was way loose and moved my harness ropes way back on the boom and that seemed to help but by then the wind was getting too much and I headed to shore to rig the 5.5 because I think I was way over powered boom was at 60 degrees to the board and when I tried to get hooked in I was sheeted in too much to do anything but point way up. Long story short those last 10 or 15 uphauls wore out my uphaul and it snapped. I tied it to the mast with the bottom free and got back to shore and called it a day.

I think you are right I need lessons. It is too slow going out making mistakes and coming back and searching forums to correct them. Not to mention that my board is looking somewhat beaten my boom is a mess and even my sail is getting rough after only a few times out. I am also a bit concerned that since I was the alone out on the lake today and actually thought I broke something when I hit the mast, that maybe I need to get some skills before I kill myself out there. At least half of my tacks ended with me climbing back on the board and uphauling.

I have been ordering my stuff from Ontario and it takes forever to get here so I will have to find a closer source to order another uphaul and my fin is getting quite ratty from trying to beachstart in the rocky shores of Nicola. I thought this was gonna be a cheap hobby but I think maybe I was wrong...

[KUS]

Tip 1= Go to an outdoor shop, pick up about 6-7' 1inch nylon webbing (it's hollow), make a loop with 2'bungie on one end, push the ends into the webbing and make a simple overhand knot with the webbing catching the ends in the knot, 2' of 4-6mm rope on the other, same, make a knot, make a few figure eight knots along the length of the webbing, voila, a new uphaul.

The bungee end loops over the base of the mast after you wrap and loop the other rope end through itself around the mast above your boom clamp.

you won't break this uphaul for a long time

Tip 1, number 1=Yes, it's a good plan to sail with an observer at least or buddy.
Tip 1 number 2=Wear a helmet, PFD at first helps too.
Tip 2 =grab your sail with your hands where it feels comfortable when moving and check the harness lines are near the middle of this spread between your hands, they don't need to be far apart, the new harness lines are even joined in one spot for some products.
Tip 3 = Morewind is in France or almost

Lessons Schmessons, it's fun to learn through trial and error
Gear? I got gear! Greyhound one day Check used.Victoria.com and of course this site's Buy Sell section in the Forum pages, probably a better bet for beginners/intermediates to pick up good used stuff.

Keep at 'er, nice going!

[Ozz]

Ack! Sorry More force It must have been the bump on the knoggin this afternoon (Nothing at all to do with anything that may have happened in the 60's and 70's and...)

Bungee thing is a great idea I will build one before next days off.

Truth is I just moved here and really dont know anyone so I just leave word when I hope to be back

I wore the pfd today for the second time It is a pain trying to hook on with the thing on It is a kyaking one so not to big but still awkward.

Have a kayaking helmet but cost like 75 bucks and I diddnt want it to end up looking like my mellon so it has never gotten outa the box

That is how I decided where to put the harness lines I spent some time trying to keep my hands on either side of the harness because the Learn to Windsurf at Home DVD said to put it an arms length from the mast and DVD's never lie Once I moved down the boom suddenly things started to feel a tad better

Actually I took a lesson while I impatiently waited for my board to arrive (Think my board is big? You shudda seen that one! mine is 78 cm wide and that one was at least a meter ) and it got me this far but alas I am going to be forced to take 2 weeks holiday in feb and so I will use the windsurf thing as an excuse to go someplace hot. I am starting to get the hang of this thing and now winter is on the horizon it looks like I am gonna have to put it on hold. I think I am adicted This all started because I couldnt afford a hobie fx1 now it looks like this is gonna cost more in the end. I will be buying used for a while at least, I bought new because I diddnt know what to get and it seemed like the fastest way. The last tiem I tried windsurfing was in the 70's and I had no sucess but only got to try it once (may have been under the influence of mind altering substances at the time too ) This time was much easier.

To tell the truth I did have a quick peek at the 110l board you had in the classifieds

[more force 4]

[edit- simultaneous postings!]
Kus does have good gear at very reasonable prices; we're lucky in Victoria & Lower Mainland to also have at least 3 retail shops that deal in gear, though the two in Victoria are downsizing (while Kus grabs their market share ).

Sounds like you are doing very well indeed! That first full-blast plane is something you'll always remember. There's a long thread on this 'planing way out of control' (I think it called ) in the beginners forum of Boards.co.uk - I can't paste a link because their site isn't working right now, but its a funny and interesting read of people right where you are now.

Your probably at the most punishing stage, with hard catapaults and bruises; but rest assured this doesn't last long and gives you bragging rights! (Helmet are obvious; lifejackets can do more than float you, they provide some good padding!).

Oh, yes, when you pop up onto a plane and feel out of control (like tearing away downwind....), remember foot steering will now work (bank in the direction you want to go); and deeply bending the knees and soaking up the bumps will help keep you attached to the water.

[Ozz]

Oh yeah I will remember
My brain was saying steer! my hands were saying bail! my sphinctor was saying...well never mind that but my feet were not listening to any of it and in the end the decision was out of my control.

Question now is can I ever go out in low winds again?

Good to know that Kuz can supply this stuff My biggest worry is not so much breaking stuff but the time lost waiting to replace it. When i was looking for a retailer I couldnt find any listings for bc.

On the plus side I am back to work tomorrow so the rest of you can expect good conditions for 4 days before it turns nasty again

[UnusuallyLargeRobin]

Harness line positions: British wsurf guru Guy Cribb measured numerous pro, advanced and competent wsurfer line postions, almost without exception everyone of them had their back strap 1/3 of the chord length from the boom front, the front strap was then typically 4-6 inch spread from the back strap position. As a beginner you may find it more comfortable with a larger spread between back and front straps. Your sail will tell you the correct boom length, your back strap should be 1/3 of that length from the front of the mast in a straight line (chord) towards the tail of the boom (not along the curvature of the boom!). Use a tape measure. The only exception to this was if you are under 5'6" tall and less than 140lbs (not you apparently), in which case you may want to move the back strap forward by up to 2"

[more force 4]

Question now is can I ever go out in low winds again?

Another wind snob is born

[Jude]

Low winds give us the opportunity to teach our buddies how to windsurf and hone our wacky old school freestyle moves ;)

[more force 4]

http://www.boards.co.uk/forum/forum_pos ... 20117&PN=1 Here's the Boards thread, it has lots of advice for getting into the harness and straps (there are lots of others on the same topics, but this was appropriately titled!)

[Ozz]

Got my measuring tape out today and one harness line was within 2 inches of 1/3 of the boom length the other is a little farther forward Kinda hard to adjust the things while balancing in the waves. Interesting enough the Cuy Cribb is the guy giving lessons in Venezuela in Feb ; coincidence I think not!

I wont give up the low winds altho my wacky freestyle moves are limited to thrashing around under the sail trying to get my harness unhooked

I checked out that link It is nice to know that there is other geriatric windsurfers out there learning too kinda makes me feel less senile. Believe it or not I took it up because I thought it would be a serene way to spend the day. I diddnt know about planing at all at the time I thought it was like sailing but standing up. Then I got the board and when found it didnt have beverage holders I began to get the idea that maybe there was more to it than that.

[KUS]

now there is a marketing angle nobody has explored fully....wave boards with beverage holders. DWD, a photoshop design creation, if you please?