Foils for Wingfoiling

[AJSpencer]

As I’ve eluded to a bit here and there lately, I’m trying to join the cool kid… er… Axis club and have been doing a bit of research.
So much info and variations out there.
My personal conclusion is I want a high aspect, straighter front wing for efficiency and speed, pumpability, wavability. Lots of cm2 for my weight and early take-off, but the high aspect wings have nice upper speed range so I shouldn’t be battling keeping it down on the super windy days.
I’m also still a bit confused between black and red series, but I think the larger wings are only available in the red series.

What I’m leaning towards is:
AXIS Foils - Build Your Own Red Series AXIS Foils - Build Your Own Red Series
Front Wing Size: PNG 1150
Rear Wing Size: 440 Freeride
Fuselage: Standard Aluminium Fuselage
Aluminium Mast Length 19mm: 900mm
Fuselage/Mast Adapter: 19mm Doodad
Mast Plate 19mm: 19mm Base Plate
Screws/TefGel: Titanium Screws/Tef Gel
Price
$1,770.00 USD

or

AXIS Foils - Build Your Own Black Series
Front Wing Size: HPS 1050
Rear Wing Size: 400 Freeride
Black Fuselage: Standard 765mm
Aluminium Mast Length 19mm: 1050mm
Fuselage/Mast Adapter: 19mm Doodad
Mast Plate 19mm: 19mm Base Plate
Screws/TefGel: Titanium Screws/Tef Gel
Remove
Price
$1,732.00 USD


What do you guys think of either one of those selections?
Also what do you think for mast length? I think my current is around 80cm and seems pretty good but occasional foil-out (my fault). Go for longer or is 80-90cm the favourite?
And mast material? Worth adding ~$700 to go to carbon mast?

Thanks for any tips.

[tweezer]

AJ, You can't go wrong with either the 1150 or 1050. The 1150 at 1700cm2 will give you earlier lift but less top-end speed than the 1050 at 1500cm2. The 1050 will have a little more racey feel and the 1150 more cruisey. Those are highly technical terms BTW Both ULR and Junky have 1150's. I've tried the 1150 and, for my weight, it is a perfect light wind foil. I haven't tried the 1050 but regularly use a 980 HPS for 15+ knots and love it.
For the mast I would go in the range of 80 - 90. I prefer the 90 for chop clearance and less foil outs. Aluminum works great in my experience. Your mileage may vary. They have been known to bend laterally on occasion (Tyl bent his first try unfortunately!). My suggestion would be to purchase an extra front wing with that $700 you saved on the aluminum mast vs carbon.

[AJSpencer]

Thanks Tweeze. Follow up question: if say I get the 1150 setup and get a smaller front wing for windier days, would I need to also use a smaller rear wing or could I get by with just a ~400cm2 freestyle rear wing for both front wings?

[tweezer]

One rear wing should work for both. Not sure which rear is best with those wings. The axis foil riders group on facebook is a good resource. The 420mm is a common favourite. I regularly use one with my 980 (1300cm2). It is 420mm span not area.
For the fuselage, I use mainly the short (68cm) fuses. Standard will be more stable/less pitchy than a short. But for maneuverability, I like the short and many guys prefer the ultra short.

[Atomic-Chomik]

I've been on all of them. I personally prefer the 1050 but it's like it says, high performance speed aka not terribly forgiving'ish.
The 1150 is limited in its range, it doesn't take much to be overfoiling on it.

Now as it so happens I just talked to my buddy today who wants to sell his axis 900/1000 with two fuselages standard and short, with a 440 stab for $2200cad. the 900/1000 wings are older but incredible wings that are really, really good for winging.

Or, get the back series one and buy the used twice 890 wing that I have off me.

[AJSpencer]

I've been on all of them. I personally prefer the 1050 but it's like it says, high performance speed aka not terribly forgiving'ish.
The 1150 is limited in its range, it doesn't take much to be overfoiling on it.

Now as it so happens I just talked to my buddy today who wants to sell his axis 900/1000 with two fuselages standard and short, with a 440 stab for $2200cad. the 900/1000 wings are older but incredible wings that are really, really good for winging.

Or, get the back series one and buy the used twice 890 wing that I have off me.

Hm that might work. Which front wings are those? I’m most interested in the straight, high aspect wings (like an airplane) and not so much the curvy turny ones. I’m guessing those “older” ones are pretty curved?

If buying new, I’m thinking the 1150 for 10-20 knots and 910 for 20+. Pricey pricey…

[AJSpencer]

Can anyone who’s flown a png 1150 and png 1010 answer this question:
If I have a png 1010, is it worth spending the money to get the 1150 or is the low end range gain barely noticeable?

[Windjunky]

I really like my 1150 for light wind pretty sure i can get going in 8-10 knots with 6M wing at 200lbs. more lifty and faster than my 2000cm NP which is probably similar to infinity 84. Got the 999 for 15 plus which requires black fuselage which I haven't really had a chance to try. Can't comment on 1050 or 1010 sorry.

[AJSpencer]

Wow sweet to unlock that 8-12 range. I guess I’ll just have to find out how light I can go with the 1010 and if its 15+ for me, probably worth getting the 1150.
RBFC tomorrow.

[tweezer]

I rode the 1010(1430cm2) regularly this season in sub 15 knots. ULR was brave enough to let me try his 1150(1778cm2) this fall and I used it 3 or 4 times in sub 15. For me they overlap enough it wouldn’t be worth having both. The 1150 will have a little more low end without sacrificing the top end much. At 75kg I’m good with the 1010 for low end. If you are a little heavier I’d go with the 1150. Here's another review... https://www.thefoilingmagazine.com/test ... -and-1150/
Cheers
Mark (tweezer)

[Swangtang]

Aj what did you end up buying?

I just bought an HPS1050 with 400 freeride rear, ultra short fuse, and 82 cm aluminum mast. Hoping this setup works for me in 10-25 knts.

[AJSpencer]

I got Mr.NS's old set-up: 1010 PNG, 390 rear wing. It was shocking the first day I used it after using the Slingshot system, like going from a Buick to a Porche. Difference in performance was dramatic. All my wings suddenly became too big because of the increase in apparent wind and overall efficiency (had to get a 3m, and I'm 200lbs)
I'm not too confident on the true numbers of low-end wind range but I think if its gusting 13-14 knots I can get flying and go through 8-12knot holes while still being powered up on my big wing (6.5m). If it was the Slingshot, I'd get up and wouldn't be able to go upwind and wouldn't make it through the holes. With the Axis I can crank upwind in the gusts and keep going with good speed through the holes on a close reach.
So, ultimately, I'm a bit disappointed I didn't spend more at the start on an Axis set-up and wasted time with the poorly designed Slingshot system. I guess this isn't a good sales pitch for my Slingshot foil set-up currently for sale.
Will probably save it for my kids as a learner foil -- at least its safe.

The 1010 seems like a nice range. I do wonder how low the 1150 could go, but I see others on here generally in the same light wind as I am on the 1010, so I think, like Tweezer said, there's quite a bit of overlap. I use the same foil in 30+ knots, just with a very small wing, but really at that point I should go with smaller foil and go faster. But I find I can just throttle my speed with a small wing and big foil, go slower, and have a surplus of lift and wind to use at my leisure.
Absolutely love the Axis set-up!

[Swangtang]

Glowing review thanks!

I'm also switching from Slingshot and have had the same experience that I could get up on foil in light wind but it was always a one way trip ddw. Great to know its the gear and not my technique :p

[smartang]

Let's take it easy on what we call a porsche.

Hoverglide - Dodge Caravan with check engine on

Axis 1010 - Buick/Cadillac nice a floaty in a straight line

Armstrong 725/lift120 - Mid level Porsche - handling/agility/ good speed but not the fastest

Mikeslab - Lambo.

[AJSpencer]

haha ^^ I guess I thought Buick was = to Dodge. Cadillac, ok.
Nice to know re: mikeslab.

Hey, my rear wing which is a pretty flat 390, somehow got cracked — must have hit something. Going to try to reinforce it, but I’d also like a new or used rear wing. Anyone have tips on a good well-rounded rear wing for use mostly with the 1010png front wing, red series?