How we use the University of Washington Wind Model

bwd · Post by **bwd** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 7:05 pm

Thanks everyone for the feedback, I'm sure it will help. I discovered that I had a link to UofW website below the forecast table that showed the status of their model. So every time someone looked at the tables it also accessed their website. If you check the BWD webstats below this could account for close to 60,000 views per month out of the 77,000 shown on their webstats. So I removed this. I have also changed it so my computer only checks for updates twice per hour from 9am-1pm and 9pm-12am. This should also reduce traffic by 1/3 to 1/2.

I think they want users to start paying to access the data, especially ones that are making a profit from it. This helps pay for their operating costs which is understandable. I think we may have a hard time convincing them we are non-profit, especially with the ads on the forecast page. We are likely a special case, but I'm expecting that we will lose access to this data.

saulman wrote:I was actually curious about the traffic on Dave's forecast summary pages? As was pointed out earlier, people hitting Dave's forecast summary pages are saving bandwidth that would otherwise be hitting the U's severs directly. If the U is worried about folks viewing their data without knowing who did the work, have a look at the top referrers. Lots of people are looking at the U's site because of BWD.

Good Point Saulman:
For the one week period from Oct 25-31, 2009:
Pageviews 14,176
Unique Visitors 4,845
Roughly 2200 pageviews per day, or 60,000 per month

Mike C · Post by **Mike C** » Sun Nov 01, 2009 10:36 pm

The model is an essential tool for the British Columbia Windsurfer. I would go so far as to say that it reduces fuel consumption of wind-chasers because we nolonger have to rely on the overly-optimistic Environment Canada forecasts!

AC · Post by AC » Mon Nov 02, 2009 7:09 am

I use it about 2 times a day

Winger · Post by **Winger** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 7:36 am

I use this model every week to plan my recreation activities. It really helps save time and energy ( gas and otherwise) when you know when and where to go. Please let us continue to use your information for clean,fun, recreational sports.

Cj · Post by Cj » Mon Nov 02, 2009 8:47 am

I check the model every night before bed and every morning.

UnusuallyLargeRobin · Post by **UnusuallyLargeRobin** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 9:35 am

I previously mentioned on the message board that I noticed UW has links to BWD webcams off their main page! They can reference us but not the other way around? Come on! this should be all about information sharing and better outcomes for the public using weather resources.
http://www.atmos.washington.edu/data/webcams.html
Under BC, the last 3 are BWD cams

GregK · Post by **GregK** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 9:59 am

Hopefully U of W don't mis-interpret a few small ads from commercial sponsors.

Surely they'll see that joining the forum is free, and that you don't have to join to access almost the entire site, especially the really awesome pages, like reports, webcams, and forecasts.

Surely they'll click on the HOME / Donate page and see donations are barely keeping up with new equipment purchases.

I would be very sad to see the Wind Prediction model go. If U of W need funding to cover their costs, well I can’t argue against “user-pay” and the realities of no free lunch. I can only hope that some reasonable solution can be found to preserve BWD’s truly awesome manipulation of the U of W model data into very user-friendly Wind Prediction tables.

bwd · Post by **bwd** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 10:15 am

After some more discussion, it appears that they are mainly having a problem with the automated queries that my home computer does to grab the data that generates the model tables. They would rather have me put up links to their website and have everyone retrieve the data from them. This would take us back to pre 2005 when all I had was links to their website and the individual image pages. So this is likely where we will end up, which in my opinion is a big step backward in data sharing and weather forecasting. The model tables were meant to make it easier for people to check the forecasts quickly without having to load and interpret individual images.

The model tables are what I am most proud of on the website. The forecasts page is the most popular page next to the home page. I like to think that it has brought a lot of exposure to their model/UofW over the years and they should be happy that they are producing something useful and relevant that groups other than scientists and meteorologists can use. It's too bad that they will likely close down my access to the data. After that I think that our use of the model will likely decrease and eventually fade away.

For now I have reduced the model updates to once every hour. So the tables should update from about 0915am to 1215pm every hour and then again at 915pm to 1215am.

We'll see what happens but it doesn't look great. I think the model tables will disappear and you will have to get the data directly from their website. As most know that is a time consuming process. So if you want to comment on the impact of losing the summary tables and going directly to their site for the info, and also how the forecast pages and links to their website have made you aware of the MM5/WRF model that might help.
thanks
dave

UnusuallyLargeRobin · Mon Nov 02, 2009 10:28 am

Surely your reduction of access from 60,000/month to 800/month (24 accesses/hr x 31 days?) will appease them!! It will be like you've dropped off the map and don't exist anymore. I'm hoping they see this as a determined willingness to work with them and keep access. Keep the faith Dave, may the Wind Gods prevail!

On an alternative note, does the UBC models produce anywhere near the quality that you could utilize if we have too?

KUS · Post by **KUS** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 10:30 am

Even providing twice-4x daily updates (would this dramatically cut the access rate?) would suffice for my personal needs....I generally just get a sense, then extrapolate using the cams and readings. The morning updates are most important in my view, after lunch you pretty much got the lay of the land

To access the tables on their site is too time consuming and I never recall the process or which column, map or time frame I am too look at. Dave's tables have made it easy for a webmoron like myself and he is correct, I would NOT access their data (I would suggest this goes for probably 90% of the people out there) except in perhaps the most desperate times and with some help from the known gurus on which frikkin' link, c#@#$%g column, F**&^ time zone and where the #@$%ll I am to look

Step backward? I'd say completely chuck available tools and regress to looking out the window.....more webcams and WX stations I guess.....which their model will probably end up pulling data from

downwind dave · Post by **downwind dave** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:07 pm

U of W people: work with BigWaveDave, not against! he knows how to transform your model data into real useful information that can be understood by everyone.

Geoffy · Post by **Geoffy** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:48 pm

Dave - Suggestion possibly ... can you make your data manipulation/format/capture available to them to load on their site and they can use to build similar tables for other internal users and their site users, in exchange for continued access and availability thru BWD.ca?

Tables like these surely would have great user interest and value to many regions throughout Washington State coastal and inland waters. Having tried to use the image pages in the past, I was aware of the MM5 models and UofW work, but it did not have the same value it does now. Also - the recognition of the MM5 model data is now very, very widespread because of what you've contributed, here in BC and in Washington/Oregon.

newfie boy · Post by **newfie boy** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:51 pm

hope this the correct place to post about how good this sight really is. I fish and so do many of my friends and we find this sight very helpful for our sport. Thanks for your great work. Hope the site continues. Good luck.

monkeymanmike · Post by **monkeymanmike** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:02 pm

I'm what you might call a "weekend warrior" when it comes to windsurfing, but I frequently use the model and try to plan my "weekend" accordingly. I find it a much more reliable source than EC, and the details are unsurpassed. It would be a huge loss to loose access to this significant information. Please reconsider.

nanmoo · Post by **nanmoo** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:08 pm

Is there anyway the BWD formating process of the tables could be transferred into some downloadable applet that each user would download then use to access and manipulate the data directly off the UofW website? Just an idea.

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